8th World Conference (November 2005)
At 1:30 pm Dr. Gries welcomed the group back to the
fourth and final session of the conference. Dr. Goldstein made a few opening
remarks:
There are many questions about education. I will make
a brief statement. Professor Anil Kumar will make some further comments later this afternoon. The Prasanthi Council has convened a
subcommittee to review the status of SSE, SSEHV and their
relationship to the concept of Educare.
Eminent Sai educators are involved, including Dr. Pal Dhall, Dr. Art-Ong
Jumsai, Ronne Marantz, Bea Flaig, Victor Kanu, Thorbjorn Meyer, Tom Scovill,
Mr. Gomez and others. They have compiled a document which is still under
deliberations. The Prasanthi Council will act on the recommendations in a way that
best serves the Sai organization.
We will now
continue with the questions.
Q18. When can
we expect the answers to the questions?
A18. (Dr.
Goldstein): It will take a while to
put all the answers in some order. They will be sent out by the Organization.
The notes from the Conference will be distributed at some point, but not in the
next few days.
A question from this morning was about how to handle difficulty with officers. First talk to the officer, then go to the Regional Officer, then to the Central Council President and finally to the Central Coordinator.
Sri Anil Kumar
and Sri Narasimha Murthy
Dr. Goldstein
announced that Sri Anil Kumar and Sri Narasimha Murthy, warden of Brindavan
Campus, would join in the panel discussion of those questions relating to
education/educare and spirituality. He said that Sai Spiritual Education and
Sathya Sathya Education in Human Values are ways of eliciting the human values
that are intrinsic within us. Educare is drawing out that which is within, the
same as bringing forth who we really are. The teacher should be an exemplar of
these values. The teaching techniques used are silent sitting, group
activities, group singing, quotes and stories as components of the pedagogic
formula. The only difference is that SSEHV is used in public schools and based
on the Unity of Faiths, whereas SSE focuses on the teachings of the Kali Yuga
Avatar, Bhagawan Sri Sathya Sai Baba.
(Sri Narasimha Murthy): Educare is all about spirituality. In the Bhagavad Gita, Sri Krishna has said, “Among all types of education, I am spiritual education.” The tragedy is that now God and spirituality have no place in education in schools and colleges. Spiritual education is cultivating faith and devotion in all hearts, which is what Swami has been doing. It is our duty that we do this. In fact, I found a young boy in school wearing a T-shirt. On the front, it said, “I was born good but spoiled by education.” On the back, “I was born smart, but made dull by education.”
This is what has been going on in education. In contrast, as in Swami’s schools, it is important to implement values education in all schools from primary to college level.
(Sri Anil Kumar):
Yesterday, I gave a talk, ‘Education to Educare’, and did not speak on all the
points. Educare deals with the center of our life. It cannot be taught. It is
the truth of our being. Education deals with the periphery of your life.
Educare is the very being of life, it
is the center. Education and Educare are not contradictory. Both are necessary.
Root [Educare] and fruit [education] go together Awareness, alertness, awake-ness,
responsiveness, acceptance and conviction are features of Educare, not to be acquired. To be in the presence of Swami is the
best form of Educare. Educare is beyond religion. It is spiritual.
Q19. Is Love
really necessary when the demonic personalities can also attain liberation?
A19. (Sri
Narasimha Murthy): Demons are
symbols for gluttony, anger, jealousy, sleepiness, etc. The demon Kumbakarna
exemplifies that. But his Love for God finally overcame these to take him to
the Lotus feet. Kumbakarna and Ravana were two brothers, who were doorkeepers
to Vishnu in their previous births, cursed by Sage Brighu who was frustrated by
them in his access to Vishnu. They had the choice to take either nine births as
friends of the Lord and then return to the Lotus feet or three births as
enemies of the Lord. They chose three births. They were born as Hiranyaksha and
Hirayakashyapu, Ravana and Kumbkarana and Dantavakra and Shishupala, in three
births. After these three lives, they went back to Vishnu.
Where there is
true Love, all negativities fly away. If we develop Love, we will overcome all
weaknesses.
(Dr. Reddy): Their Love for God was so intense that they selected
to come to earth for the shortest time.
Q20. Discipline
of sevadals on the ladies’ side is severe. Can anything be done?
A20. (Dr.
Goldstein): Sevadals are volunteers
and are not highly trained or experienced. They are doing their
best. Forgive them and be patient and gracious. Clearly, if their transgressions are serious we will take up these
issues if you bring them to our attention.
(Sri Anil Kumar): Sevadals are not paid or trained. They are there to
enhance Sadhana. It also helps our Sadhana by bending to the discipline. Once,
a devotee was trying to offer Swami a letter in darshan. The devotee was
roughly restrained by the sevadal. Then Swami reached over and took the letter.
The sevadal was looking distressed and feared she was being corrected. But
Swami consoled her by saying, “you did your duty, and I did mine.”
Q21. You said
that Swami was not happy because we had not changed in 20 years. Are there any
signs of change now?
A21. (Dr. Goldstein):
This is not quite what Swami said. He did say, we are not taking seriously His
teachings: your lives have not changed. You have the same habits and are not
applying the teachings. Time is the body of God. You have access to the Divine
teachings, but do not take them seriously. Swami is never unhappy. He is
encouraging us to become blissful.
Q22. Kindly
elaborate on conscious, conscience and consciousness.
A22. (Sri Narasimha Murthy): According to Swami, Conscious refers to the body and senses. Conscience refers to the subtle body and mind, and the Divine spark that makes the body work. Consciousness is the one source from which everything emerges. In Ramayana, Rama asked Hanuman, “Who are you?” He replied, “When I have body consciousness, I am your servant. When I feel the Divine spark within, I am part of You. When I realize the ultimate truth, You and I are one.”
(Sri Anil Kumar): What is limited to the body and senses is conscious.
God in me is Conscience. God is everywhere, that is Consciousness.
Q23. What are
the aspects and milestones by which we may measure our spiritual progress?
A23. (Sri
Narasimha Murthy): People have
misconceptions about how to assess spiritual progress. There are four
yardsticks that I call, a,b,c and d. These are based on Swami’s teachings and
the Bhagavad Gita. (a) awareness of inner joy and Love; (b) balance of
mind, equanimity, (c) control of desires and senses (to what extent have
you mastered the senses?); and (d) dedication of Selfless Service for
the welfare of
others. This
contains all the essence of the scriptures. Remember that we can be egocentric
even in doing Swami’s work.
Q24. Is it
necessary to teach mantras, slokas and 108 names in Western countries?
A24. (Sri Anil Kumar):
Please do not do this. Following Baba’s teachings is not a religion. Baba said
all names are Mine. Teachings such slokas is conversion. Sathya Sai
Organization is not a sect. We will invite animosity by doing this. Sathya Sai represents Unity of Religions. God does not speak only
Sanskrit, God speaks English also. Use your mother tongue for prayers.
Q25. How to
achieve unity in thought, word and deed.
A25. (Dr. Reddy): Swami said that great souls have harmony of thought,
word and deed. Swami corrects us when we deviate from this. Swami says that
practice of unity in thought, word and deed is the penance for this age.
Q26. What is
the difference between emotion and devotion?
A26 (Sri Narasimha Murthy):
It is the Bhava that leads to Avesha, thrill in devotion, and
that leads to Bhava-Samadhi, ecstasy of union with God. Ramakrishna said
that the power of emotion leads to experience of devotion which leads to
Samadhi. Ramakrishna used to
dance like a madman. His devotees started to imitate him, to show their
devotion. Vivekananda said, “Do not be sentimental fools.” However devotion is
Love for God and is an emotion. But this emotion is free of attachments. We can
become mad with joy. Devotion is not sentimental. It is feelings from the heart
that lead to the experience of devotion, and it further leads to union with
God.
Once Swami
materialized a matchbox and took out a match and struck it to light it. Then he
took out another match, dipped it in water, and struck it. This match did not
light. He said, in devotion, if there are attachments, it will be like the wet
matchstick.
(Sri Anil Kumar): Distilled, crystallized, solid emotion is devotion.
Q27. Can a
person be involved in business, i.e., in material life, and also lead a
spiritual life?
A27. (Sri Anil
Kumar): Why not? We are all
examples of this. Spiritual life is not giving up our daily routines and
running away from the world and neglecting our respective duties and
responsibilities. It is an attitude, it is awareness and understanding, it is
what we do and how we act. If I do my job as service to God, and offer my work
to God, that is a spiritual life. There is only one work – God’s work. All is
spiritual, whatever we do. There is no secular or sacred. All is Swami’s. Begin
every job with a prayer and end the day offering the fruits to the Lord. That
is spiritual life.
As long as there
is separation of secular and spiritual, we miss the point.
The conference
was officially closed with the assembly chanting the prayer, Loka Samastha, Sukhino
Bhavantu (May all the worlds be happy!).